Hey, I just thought I'd share this email conversation with a couple other Peace Corps Volunteers here in the Darien area. We don't see each other that often so sometimes it's easier to just use email and check it when we can. I realize it's a lot to read, so don't feel obligated to go through it all, but it's kind of interesting to see some different perspectives. My response is the third one. Maybe you guys can keep me accountable and make sure I'm not going crazy out here and making up weird theology or something.
Fwd: continuing the jesus convo...
Amber Naylor
to Danielle, me, Andrew
Some light reading when you are bored...
I like to share things. I started a Jesus convo with Chelsea last week,
and then ended up writing her a follow up email about it. Thought I would share
exactly what it is I believe with you guys, since I share everything else with
you.
We can talk about it, or not. Que va.
Hey Chelsea.
When we last talked, you told me how you had trouble reconciling the
fact that being a Christian means that those who do not accept Christ as their
Savior go to hell, no matter how good of a person they are. I didn't have an
answer in words to give you at the time, because I agree with you, and after
our long days of translating, finding the right words in the right language was
very hard. So after thinking about it, here's what I believe, and I hope that
it helps you as you try to figure out how this whole religion thing fits into
your life.
-I believe that those who preach and act like there is absolutely only
one way to get into heaven are cocky, and are probably trying to sell me
something. NO ONE KNOWS. No one. It does not matter how old or young you are,
what religion or culture you are, or whether you are ordained as a minister or
whether you teach evolution to high schoolers. We are all just trying to figure
it out before we die.
-I believe there is a God. He or she may have a variety or names and be
represented in different forms, but I believe there was one Creator that
started this whole thing- whether that beginning was a big explosion or a week
of work- and helps guide us still. I find my proof in nature and music, and in
those tiny coincidences of life whose ripple effects have huge impacts.
-I believe there is a heaven. I realize it is highly possible nothing
happens after we die, but where is the fun in that? I choose to believe that we
are all here as a part of something bigger, something greater. That no matter
what trials life throws my way there is always something better for me later
on. That I never have to say an eternal goodbye to my loved ones because
immortality is waiting. It gives me hope.
-I believe that God sent his only son to earth to show us how much he
loves us. That he let that son be sacrificed at the hands of other human beings
for our sins to let us know that we are worthy of eternal life and that we are
valuable human beings. I believe that Jesus was our living example- 'Look, if
this lowborn son of a prostitute can do great things, spend his life serving
others, AND go to heaven, SO CAN YOU!'
-I believe that a bunch of men wrote the Bible. I believe they wrote it
with good intentions, but they, like all others, had cultural biases and
language barriers. So to be perfectly blunt, I think a lot of the Bible is
crap. And I am perfectly ok saying that.
-I believe there is more than one way to heaven. I know that my
Christianity stems from how I was raised and my culture. To me, to say that
only Christians get to go to heaven is like saying only people who speak
English get to go to heaven. I believe that nearly all religions are just
different flavors of the same ice cream. I think heaven is full of Buddhists,
Jews, and Muslims too. I think entrance into heaven has more to do with having
good sportsmanship and less to do with picking the right sports team. (aka
being a good person, and note that being a good person and being sinless are
not the same thing) I don't know that aetheists get in, having outwardly
proclaimed God doesn't exist, but really, I don't KNOW anything. I think God
reserves the right to make that decision on a case by case basis. For the sake
of my good friend's fiance who was killed in Iraq saving his friend's life, I
hope there are exceptions, because he was a truly great guy that just didn't
believe in God.
-I believe there is a hell for those who find joy and pleasure in
inflicting pain and anguish on others. I believe that no matter what they say
their religion is that God knows who they are. I believe there is a special
place in hell for those who use religion as a tool to enslave others, rather
than to empower them
-I believe I am just as Christian as the Pope, even though I have some
beliefs that are decidedly unorthodox. Because religion is not a science. I
find that religion is at its best when it inspires us to better ourselves, to
serve others, to love unconditionally, and to try to make the world a little
bit better than it was today. Everyone finds their inspiration in different
things- artwork, music, nature, stories, etc. Therefore different religions
inspire different people, and there is no right answer. Or maybe there is, but
no one on earth knows it. So take your best guess and go with what makes you
happy.
-I believe that by just having faith in something greater makes me a
stronger person, able to accomplish greater tasks. Knowing that, whether or not
at the end of the day my faith is in the right place is irrelevant. It gets me
through today, and gives me the hope I need to tackle tomorrow.
When I hear people say things like 'Absolute Truth', or 'Every Christian
knows the Bible is the Word of God', or 'I need to save this person', it makes
me a little crazy. Absolute Truth is crap, because nobody knows anything. That
is why it is called faith. That is is the beauty of religion- that even though
there are no definite answers, one chooses to believe and trust in higher
power. As far as the Bible, lets not even get me started on the examples of ridiculousness.
You know what they are. And I am no less of a Christian for my beliefs on that!
As far as saving others goes, who says your way is any better than theirs?!
Chelsea, as far as the heaven vs. hell concern, it is totally valid.
Believe whatever feels true to you. I choose to believe that God doesn't send
good people to hell just because they don't know Jesus. But maybe I am wrong.
Maybe Mother Teresa and Gandhi are burning in hell while Hitler sips champagne
in heaven. Who knows. But that just doesn't feel right to me. I choose not to
believe that.
If you want to call yourself a Christian, call yourself a Christian. No one can prove you
wrong!
...
Danielle Renzi
Feb 24
to Amber, me, Andrew
I meant to send this a while ago :) my thoughtss...
Ok so I both agree and disagree. For me, it’s more about the journey and
less about the destination. The only way I can reconcile the world in my head
is that if you honestly and sincerely search for the Truth, for God, for
spiritual guidance, you will find it – whether that’s Islam, Hinduism, Christianity,
lo que sea. That being said, I think
there is one correct answer. I mean, if we are assuming that there is life
after death and that life after death will be different for Gandhi than for
Hitler, then there has to be some type of distinguishing factor (i.e. the way
you lived your life). THAT being said, I don’t think humans have found or are
capable of finding that one correct answer.
So yes, I believe that all religions are inherently wrong. I mean if you
look at every major religion, there are at least a few different sects; there
are always different interpretations of the same holy texts. What that means to
me is that, even if it is true that God sent his Son to save us and inspired
many men over centuries to write the Bible – there are still hundreds of
different interpretations and new religions are being invented continuously.
The problem is that being part of a religion can be an extremely
positive part of life – it gives you a community, it holds you to a higher
standard (let’s be honest, when I have concrete rules to follow, I’m more
likely to follow them than if I just “try to be a good person”), and can
provide you with resources and opportunities in all facets of your life. So
then what it all comes down to for me, is the journey. I will go on mine and
everyone else will go on theirs. Whether that means reading the bible or the
Koran or peer-reviewed journal articles or maybe even just praying really hard,
is irrelevant. The point is that you are sincerely looking. That you are sincerely and actively trying to
make yourself a better person, always.
A religion, for me then, is not what I believe to be 100% correct. It
should be an aide to my journey; a group of people that are on the same journey
as me, that are there to help and support me.
I respect that others may come to a different conclusion than me and
that’s ok. I have to hope that the way I live my life is as close to
"right" as possible, and if not, then at least God knows I tried :)
...
Ever since
I read this email it got me thinking. Unfortunately that thinking never got
around to forming a coherent response… Until now (hopefully), only a few months
later. I appreciated you both sharing on a little bit heavier topic. There are
a lot of things you wrote that I agree with. There are also things I disagree
with. I think we can disagree and still respect each other’s beliefs.
I believe
God exists and is the creator of everyone and everything. I believe that he
inspired people to write the Bible, to share their stories of faith, their spiritual
journeys. That’s why I read the Bible; it gives me strength and wisdom, and
reminds me how God has used ordinary people like me in the past. It also gives
me direction in my life wherever I may end up.
In the
Bible the first Christians were called that because they were simply following
Christ. That was the definition of a Christian. When I read the book of Acts, I
strive to be like those Christians. Their way of life was very simple but
profound. Now it seems that label can mean a wide variety of things, including someone
who goes to church, a “good person,” or someone who is “religious.” I don’t
currently attend a church, I’m often not real good, and I don’t consider myself
religious. But I say I am a Christian, because those are not things that define
my faith. I have a personal relationship with Jesus, not just a religion to be
contained by.
I do not
believe that our goal in life should be to try and figure out how to get into
heaven. To me that’s sort of an egocentric perspective. According to Jesus,
life is a lot more about letting go of our own selfish desires and living in
community with all of creation. I don’t believe that God just wants us to
follow a set of rules and regulations that determine whether or not we earn
admission to heaven. I do believe that God wants us to have true life right
now, to live in a way that causes positive change in the world through personal
relationships with individuals.
I believe
that our eternal state of being does not depend on whether or not we are a good
person. When I read the Bible I see that eternal life is a gift that we can
never earn. We can never be good enough to deserve to live in the presence of
God. To me that is what’s so beautiful about salvation. Nobody is good enough,
but anybody can receive it. When Jesus walked on earth he ran into a whole lot
of people that weren’t supposed to “get in” to heaven – tax collectors,
prostitutes, convicts, and people viewed as “sinners.” Ironically those were
the people he was drawn to and most accepting of. Having said that, I think
that obviously we should be trying our best to do as much good as we can. But
that should be a product of God’s love, not an effort to earn salvation.
Lately the
idea of universal truth has become increasingly popular, even among religious
groups. That is saying that everyone makes their own truth, that truth is
relative. I cannot in good conscience agree with that. If I personally believe
that I can breathe underwater, it doesn’t mean that I won’t drown if I try. I
believe that truth is something that nobody except God knows completely, but it
cannot simply change depending on the person. To put it plainly, I don’t
believe that the universe revolves around me; therefore I don’t have much say
in how things work.
I think
sometimes people get frustrated with the North American church, and see it as representing
an entire belief system. But that’s just one small part of the church. I have
met believers in different parts of the world that have completely different
ways to live following Jesus based on their culture and environment. I have
listened to songs praising God in languages I didn’t know existed. I have seen
people in poverty who have incredible generosity because of their faith in
Jesus. It’s amazing to see how people so different still share a faith that
crosses all barriers. I agree that religion is flawed, and that many terrible
things have come out of religion. Sometimes I hesitate to call myself a
Christian, because of all the negative connotations it has and the ways people
have been hurt by religion. That’s why I don’t consider my faith a religion but
rather a relationship. At the same time I recognize that no matter how flawed
the church might be, rather than rejecting it I should be trying to reconcile
it for good. Having that faith community is essential to me. Like Danielle
said, it’s a group of people on the same journey, to be there when you need
help. My church back home is a family that encourages each other in our faith.
We are messed up people that are trying to figure out how to live as Jesus
would, and making lots of mistakes along the way. But if everyone was perfect
then I suppose we wouldn’t need a community around us.
Anyway I
agree with Amber that seeing how insignificant we are with our tiny brains in
this vast universe, there is no way we can fully comprehend life after death.
There is no way we can know or judge the fate of anyone else. I realize that of
course I don’t have all the answers. I don’t understand a lot of things. But
that doesn’t mean there aren’t answers. My journey is a search for the truth,
and at the same time developing a deeper relationship with God and his creation.
That is what I believe. I’d be happy to talk about it whenever.
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